Make a way to get an Elytra on Expanse


Nekhros
Fairy

Joined: over 3 years ago
1 topics
5 posts

by Nekhros » over 3 years ago

Currently, the end has been thoroughly raiding and all Elytra's are already claimed. This is gatekeeping newer players from really diving into the Expanse world. I joined with my friend a few months ago and the only way I finally got elytras was to beg in chat for someone to sell me one, until we found a mod who was giving them away to new players. Even then had to wait until I happened to be online at the same time as this mod. That is not a fun gameplay mechanic and made me feel like a jerk for having to beg for an item that has been a staple of minecraft endgame for 6 years now. On a server that prides itself on never resetting, one would expect to be able to get and use an endgame item.

 

Vanilla tweaks offers the option to have the end dragon drop an elytra.

Trimming end cities would allow them to respawn without the disruption of reseting the entire end.

The issue has already been acknowledged and addressed in the tree worlds which don't even have the problem on the same scale that Expanse has. 

 

The Expanse is a great server. And I understand the need for limiting the size of the end for storage and computational purposes, but the end wasn't limited to prevent an abundance of elytra, and that side affect needs to be addressed to keep the Expanse server from stagnating.




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RE: Make a way to get an Elytra on Expanse


CAMx_
Ancient

Joined: over 4 years ago
6 topics
9 posts

by CAMx_ » over 3 years ago

1. A mod didn't give you an elytra for free. A group of players give them out to new players to be nice and not force new players to explore the outer reaches of the end without one.

2. The outer end islands reset when staff sees a need for it and only the main island and 1000 blocks around it stay constant without resets.






RE: Make a way to get an Elytra on Expanse


Nekhros
Fairy

Joined: over 3 years ago
1 topics
5 posts

by Nekhros » over 3 years ago

That amounts to the same problem, though. The end needs more frequent trimming or another method to retrieve elytras needs to be implemented. We were told not to bother even looking in the end because we wouldn't be able to find them. A group of players giving them out to new players is a nice gesture by them, but not a solution to the existing problem. And in a way, that group contributes to the problem by hoarding the existing elytras for the players that they deem worthy. 




Last edited: over 3 years ago

RE: Make a way to get an Elytra on Expanse


CAMx_
Ancient

Joined: over 4 years ago
6 topics
9 posts

by CAMx_ » over 3 years ago

The Expanse is as vanilla as it can be, what your suggesting is basically making it a tree server. More frequent resets is about all that I can see being a viable option.

Edit: And when you're saying players hoard items that can true but most of the time when someone's played the same server for over a year they're bound to have a large amount of everything. What I and other members of the server do is an act of generosity. Back when few players played Expanse I retrieved over 40 elytras right before an end reset and have given all of those away over the course of a few months. 




Last edited: over 3 years ago

RE: Make a way to get an Elytra on Expanse


Nekhros
Fairy

Joined: over 3 years ago
1 topics
5 posts

by Nekhros » over 3 years ago

The main difference between tree servers and Expanse is the lack of teleport and lack of resets. I wouldn't want to change those at all. Saying that adding a way to get an elytra equates the Expanse to a tree server is a pretty disengenuous argument. The ONLY reason elytras are limited is because of the technical limitation of having to restrict the size of the end for storage space and computational reasons. In a completely vanilla world with no config changes, there are countless elytras avalable because you can just keep exploring further. You can't do that on a server because the world size would become unsustainable. So the elytra shortage is NOT a pure vanilla mechanic. It's a unfortunate side affect of a necessary server configuration. 






RE: Make a way to get an Elytra on Expanse


Nekhros
Fairy

Joined: over 3 years ago
1 topics
5 posts

by Nekhros » over 3 years ago

And I'm not trying to bash you for your generosity. You are coming from a good place in trying to help others. That doesn't mean that the issue doesn't exist. It took me about a month of actively trying to track down a player who had one in order to get an elytra. I had 2 stacks of diamonds ready to pay for whoever would sell me one and couldn't get one until Lighty finally gave me one for free. Your hearts are in the right place, but the server has a problem that isn't solved by your generosity.




Last edited: over 3 years ago

RE: Make a way to get an Elytra on Expanse


Worzyy
Guardian

Joined: over 4 years ago
8 topics
44 posts

by Worzyy » over 3 years ago

I understand your point of view, though I do not think that using a plugin or other non-vanilla means are a suitable solution to this problem. 

There are a few reasons for this, the first is that expanse is viewed as a more-vanilla server, and it does try to be as vanilla as reasonably possible. 
From my understanding you're responding by saying that on vanilla elytras aren't restricted.
As you said, an unlimited end is what vanilla offers which cannot be the case here due to computer limitations. Though suppose that weren't the case, and that we did have an unlimited end. I can assure you given the current playtime of the server that any elytra that would be reasonably accessible (even with an elytra) wouldn't be available, and you'd have to spend many many hours to find an unraided one.
It's not that the inaccessability of an elytra is an un-intended side effect of having a restricted end, it's simply a game feature of vanilla multiplayer. 

That said, we do have 'end resets' when there is a need, which brings more elytras into the game when there's a need. 
Admittadely, that need seems to be tied with the current elytra supply held by the long-playing generous players and if you're active in a different timezone to them that can be annoying, and I think this is something that can be reasonably addressed. But importantly it's something that needs to be addressed within the community, and not something that should be imposed. 

Anticipating a response, you may ask why the long-lasting players feel the need, or have the desire to hoard elytras... 
The answer is simply to help newer players out. Historically if players such as Cam and Lighty do not collect elytras to distribute, then the elytras will still be collected but usually by players who won't be active, meaning the elytras are held in a form of purgatory. 

From a game-play perspective, the risk of losing an elytra still adds a healthy element of survival minecraft on a server where most of the difficulty has dissapeared due to farms etc. One thing that the generous players do really well, is that they only distribute one free elytra, and are often willing to sell others for a fee. This adds risk to deaths and is a benefit to the survival system. 

Perhaps as a community we do need to look into resolving any issues from players who are active at different times - potentially an elytra request system... 

Just to TLDR; The elytra shortage *is* a vanilla mechanic for survival servers, it's also healthy for the game, but we should look to address the ease of requesting an elytra due to conflicting active timezones.




Last edited: over 3 years ago

RE: Make a way to get an Elytra on Expanse


Nekhros
Fairy

Joined: over 3 years ago
1 topics
5 posts

by Nekhros » over 3 years ago

Again, I don't want to sound ungrateful towards Cam, Lighty, and the rest of that crew. Though admittadly, re-reading my responsese I may come off that way. But you do acknowledge that there can be an issue for those that don't play at the same time as that group in getting an elytra. I like the idea you propose in your TLDR since I had the name of someone who I should request one from for about a week and a half before he was actually online at the same time as me. 

 

But to counter your point about selling one for a fee, I would challenge you to try to buy one. Like I said, I had 2 stacks of diamonds willing to trade for an elytra. Every time I logged in I spammed chat with wanting to buy one. The market simply doesn't exist. The only responses I got were to check someones store (guaranteed to be sold out) and talk to that crew that would give me a free one. A free one is a nice gesture, but as I found out, that's the ONLY way to get one right now on the server.




Last edited: over 3 years ago

RE: Make a way to get an Elytra on Expanse


Worzyy
Guardian

Joined: over 4 years ago
8 topics
44 posts

by Worzyy » over 3 years ago

I understand that you're not coming from a point of ungratefulness - you're simply making a suggestion to improve the core game so that they wouldn't need to offer that service, however I disagree that expanse should be made less vanilla because of it.

For quite some time now (over a year) the elytras on expanse have always been available in this way - from players. Because of this, most people on the server are aware that they should direct newer players to them. 
My point about buying one, is that if you do offer to buy one from these players, and they have enough stock, then they will usually sell you one. This point isn't countered by saying that it's difficult to buy one. - that simply raises the issue that it can be difficult to contact them, which is the concern I mention the TLDR. 

Cam and I are both on the expanse team, so we thank you for your suggestion and will discuss methods players can use to obtain Elytras easier/ contact players faster so that new players can benefit.

Thanks again :) 










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